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Lt Zealotic

Give me my 1200 MS points back or actually HELP US, BEHEMOTH

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This is my first time posting here, and i'd like to express my opinion on this.

I purchased Castle Crashers a few days ago, after having problems clearing a gamecard code with microsoft (it wasn't "activated", apparently). My friend said nothing but good things about it, and after trying the demo i was hyped up ready to play alongside him. It's a shame we found it completely unplayable. I found these forums and did some research.

It's no biggie. Yeah, I'm a bit miffed i just blew 1200 points on a game i bought solely to enjoy online and it doesn't work, but if The Behemoth staff say there's a fix on the way then i believe them. I understand from the credits that a very small team made the game, and I'm always rooting for the indie developers.

I have plenty of other games to play in the mean time, and will keep checking this forum to see when the update is out! Hopefully soon [:

If more people were like you, I'd be happy. It's smart, and a good way to stop being silly. I mean, there's one thing to complain, but to do it so incessantly about a $15 game, I find that a complete waste of time just to make the people at the company feel bad, and for what? To make a point? Or to bully the people into feeling bad they let something like that slip past them?

I just find constant badgering something that needs to be abolished. It doesn't help, and it hurts people, emotionally. Sure, one person against a company is not much, but when you got so many people being unreasonable and badgering at such a level, that hurts, and it might affect their next game in a negative manner.

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Guest ramoneitor23

So guys, after this stupid "I wanna look pro" debate, i'd like to ask a question to the mods.

Is the patch on microsoft hands or is it back on TB hands?

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You'll need to get Emil, Dan, or Kelly to answer that. Use Mods with the Orange name text are UserMods, people that were like you that were selected to moderate the forums, for free, to keep peace and that kind of stuff.

But from what I'm getting from what Emil said in the Dev Blog, I'm assuming Microsoft has the TU right now, and are going back to The Behemoth every now and then with an update on certain parts of the Certification.

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But from what I'm getting from what Emil said in the Dev Blog, I'm assuming Microsoft has the TU right now, and are going back to The Behemoth every now and then with an update on certain parts of the Certification.

I'll have to crrect you on that one.

Emil has not stated if the TU was returned to them from Microsoft or not. He let us intend that Behemoth was working on it again, but now says that an NDA doesn't allow him to tell us exactly what the situation is.

However, as I said, he's let us intend that the TU is back in Behemoth's hands, for one reason or another. Better off their then corrupting save files or doing any damage XD

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But from what I'm getting from what Emil said in the Dev Blog, I'm assuming Microsoft has the TU right now, and are going back to The Behemoth every now and then with an update on certain parts of the Certification.

I'll have to crrect you on that one.

Emil has not stated if the TU was returned to them from Microsoft or not. He let us intend that Behemoth was working on it again, but now says that an NDA doesn't allow him to tell us exactly what the situation is.

However, as I said, he's let us intend that the TU is back in Behemoth's hands, for one reason or another. Better off their then corrupting save files or doing any damage XD

What I said was what I gathered, not what is right, right? :D

Anyways, this makes more sense to me, being worded like that, but that's also up for discussion. No one knows but the people directly involved, and they are under agreement to not tell anyone the details. Good enough for me, I'll just play more Fallout 3 while waiting for an update.

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Guest EternalGamer

I don't think "The Behemoth" is "evil" or "lazy" as Kelly put it. But you can be hard working and have good intentions and demonstrate complete incompetance and that is what this company has demonstrated to me.

And if the problems did not show up on the dev kits, then I want to know why NO OTHER XBLA GAME has had these sorts of problems. Either they take the time to test their stuff on retail units or they are more competant at developing software that is not so persnickety as to only work on certain units.

I know that getting angry doesn't do anybody any good at this point, but this company definitely lost a future customer in me and many of my friends. I bought Alien Hominid when it was originally released on the Gamecube, again on XBLA and bought CC day of release without even playing the demo first. But these guys have blown any good will they had with me.

I sure hope that whatever addon content they were planning they plan on giving away for FREE. They owe their fans something for the THREE MONTHS of bullshit they have had to put with.

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Guest EternalGamer
This is my first time posting here, and i'd like to express my opinion on this.

I purchased Castle Crashers a few days ago, after having problems clearing a gamecard code with microsoft (it wasn't "activated", apparently). My friend said nothing but good things about it, and after trying the demo i was hyped up ready to play alongside him. It's a shame we found it completely unplayable. I found these forums and did some research.

It's no biggie. Yeah, I'm a bit miffed i just blew 1200 points on a game i bought solely to enjoy online and it doesn't work, but if The Behemoth staff say there's a fix on the way then i believe them. I understand from the credits that a very small team made the game, and I'm always rooting for the indie developers.

I have plenty of other games to play in the mean time, and will keep checking this forum to see when the update is out! Hopefully soon [:

If more people were like you, I'd be happy. It's smart, and a good way to stop being silly. I mean, there's one thing to complain, but to do it so incessantly about a $15 game, I find that a complete waste of time just to make the people at the company feel bad, and for what? To make a point? Or to bully the people into feeling bad they let something like that slip past them?

While I agree that the venting doesn't do anything other than make people feel better for letting off steam, I'd like to see what this guys thoughts are in another two months when he is still waiting for a fix. Many of us have been waiting for over 3 months now to play the game we bought. I bought it for online play and can't even keep a game going for more than 10 minutes without getting booted and I've lost my saved data TWICE before I gave up trying to play it at all.

I can't think of any other game release that has had this major of a problem for anywhere near this length of time without being fixed.

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Look: The Behemoth has been working on the TU and it's taking longer than expected. Whoop dee do! He's not lying or lazy. There is just has a small team working through mounds of bureaucracy. It's going to take a long time.

On the other hand, anyone who is not satisfied with their purchase should have the right to return their game and have their points refunded. I'm pretty sure that "not having a return policy" is against some sort of consumer law and the team/Microsoft is actually risking legal action by not allowing people to return "defective" downloadable games.

So both sides are right. Both sides are wrong. Lets all just eat some pie and be happy or something.

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Okay, the update isn't out yet. Yeah, we're all pretty pissed about it.

But it's like crying over spilt milk; it's spilt, it's there and there is not alot you can do about it.

You can easily buy a game and complain, playing the consumer card is a wonderful thing. But what if YOU made something you were so proud of, missed a flaw and got beaten down about it constantly? It's seriously disheartening for the guys to read people seeing past the games awesomeness and focusing purely on a few bugs they missed.

Come on, people. Castle Crashers is a great game!

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Yeah, if you think about it, if Castle Crashers were a game where the online capabilities weren't even there, if people had no online to look foreward to in the first place, the core, non-online multiplayer game would still be as fun as ever. Most of the data-loss issues I experienced were from online play, so if that feature had never initially been promised, Castle Crashers would have been just as fun to invite friends over to play.

Feel free to throw snide comments at me and point out my flaws as you will, but insulting someone really doesn't accomplish much :|

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It's a shame microsoft have to approve it first, otherwise we'd have it a lot faster! Knowing them, castle crashers is just another game on the "to do" pile :P

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Guest Apollo

So wait, I just wanted to understand the "Complainers are idiots" side of the argument... you're saying it's OK to take a car off the lot and then find out that the engine stalls every 10 minutes, and then have the car company come back and say oh everything was fine when we test drove it, but we'll figure out what's wrong and get back to you when we get back to you, and that's supposed to be OK? So basically, we're supposed to bend over and take it and say thank you sir may i have another? Yeah. Sure.

Yeah, that's how real-world capitalism works. It was "only" $15, but to top it off there's been no communication about recourse due to this whole inconvenience. They BETTER offer free DLC, since I will think twice before dropping another .01 on a Behemoth app.

I find the "we tested and nothing came up" argument to be pathetic at best, a complete lie worst-case. With all the reports of people having widespread network problems alone, one would think a sizeable beta test on XBL over a real-world internet connection, and not a LAN, would have come up with some issues. And they don't do stress testing to make sure the systems can handle capacity? Comeon now. This is crazy talk. To think, we all got suckered into paying to beta test something. Awesome.

Oh, and bravo to all these companies coming out with garbage software and resting on the "we can patch later" laurels. Gears2 seems to be another one of these games, though they've got a massive budget and army to fix stuff and turn it around in no time.

But whatever, I'm not complaining, because complainers are losers. I fully enjoy purchasing a product with the sole intent to play over XBL multiplayer, and not being able to do just that. Hey, I guess I should smile and be thankful that I could at least start the game up, right fellahs? Perhaps we'll get this patch before Castle Crashers 2... ;)

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So wait, I just wanted to understand the "Complainers are idiots" side of the argument... you're saying it's OK to take a car off the lot and then find out that the engine stalls every 10 minutes, and then have the car company come back and say oh everything was fine when we test drove it, but we'll figure out what's wrong and get back to you when we get back to you, and that's supposed to be OK?

No, but then you wouldn't be silly enough to just purchase such an expensive investment without at least driving it beforehand, would you?

Don't even try to compare a video game to a car or anything else. The game hardly broke the bank to buy!

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Guest Apollo
So wait, I just wanted to understand the "Complainers are idiots" side of the argument... you're saying it's OK to take a car off the lot and then find out that the engine stalls every 10 minutes, and then have the car company come back and say oh everything was fine when we test drove it, but we'll figure out what's wrong and get back to you when we get back to you, and that's supposed to be OK?

No, but then you wouldn't be silly enough to just purchase such an expensive investment without at least driving it beforehand, would you?

Don't even try to compare a video game to a car or anything else. The game hardly broke the bank to buy!

The car analogy was an analogy in scenario only, not economics. But I guess some people don't understand that. Not to mention you can't "test drive" a video game unless they put a demo out for it , so your counterpoint (was it a counterpoint? I don't even know) is weak.

But fine, scrap the car analogy. I buy a hammer from the hardware store for $5, and the head falls off. Sure, I still have the hammerhead, and I still have the hammer handle, and I'm sure I could find some use for the 2 of them, but they certainly aren't working like the purchaser intended them to work.

Can I bring it back? In the real world, sure. In Virtual-Videogame Land, Microsoft and Behemoth (thought it's not just them, it's the whole industry) can hide behind the "We don't take refunds no matter what" legalese. Hell, what would happen if my $15 I gave them was defective and actually $5? Oh that's right, I'd be in jail for fraud! I know, I know, different situation, right? ;)

The people defending a broken product where the consumer has no recourse except to take it and like it are absolutely shameful. Oh, and since Castle Crashers didn't "break the bank" to purchase, that seems to imply that if we spent more on this game, the state of the product would THEN be unacceptable?

Regardless, many of us are complaining on principle, not on the "break the bank" theory - which is what many people who are defending this game and company are hiding behind because they can't justify such a shoddy product otherwise (I mean, it's not like we're talking some slightly glitchy graphics or something). Braid didn't have this problem, did it? I don't hear people complaining about Braid saves suddenly disappearing, and Braid's developers aren't exactly a huge shop...

But I digress. I've learned my lesson, and that's that the next time Behemoth comes out with a game, I'll let the morons who rush to pay to beta test it for the first 6 months - at which point hopefully the patch will come out before I forget it's out and move onto some other title. I'm tired of being one of the morons who beta tested Castle Crashers when it was in production.

PS - you wanna talk about breaking the bank? I don't know Behemoth's financial situation, but I can guarantee they're high-fiving microsoft's no refund policy, else they'd be in a financial world of hurt right about now.

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You complainers are annoying!!!!!!! :twisted::evil:

I lost all of my data, and I still LOVE this game.

Behemoth can't do anything now, Microsoft has to approve the patch.

A few topics complaining are ok.

But on the forums lately, (Both this one and the Xbox ones) there are about 1000 topics complaining, even though they are well aware that the patch is going to come out soon.

The Behemoth is not some company that makes a glitchy game just to get laughs from people losing their data.

If you disagree with me, then send this guy a friend request:

http://forums.xbox.com/23700248/ShowPost.aspx

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You complainers are annoying!!!!!!! :twisted::evil:

I lost all of my data, and I still LOVE this game.

Behemoth can't do anything now, Microsoft has to approve the patch.

A few topics complaining are ok.

But on the forums lately, (Both this one and the Xbox ones) there are about 1000 topics complaining, even though they are well aware that the patch is going to come out soon.

The Behemoth is not some company that makes a glitchy game just to get laughs from people losing their data.

If you disagree with me, then send this guy a friend request:

http://forums.xbox.com/23700248/ShowPost.aspx

I checked those forums, and not only does it have the most ridiculous arguments (each is about, what, 10 words) but it has the strongest counterarguments I have ever seen for the Behemoth.

I mean, at least here the reasons for complaining are valid, strong and backed up with evidence! Colino, you are one of the strongest arguers here! Your complaining at least makes sense!

Look at this line from the forums:

"oh yeah ok, they cant determine if online problems are going to happen or not they just release the game and hope all online activity run smoothly ok yeah. your full of BS."-BigRed Whale 1

"I just want what the F%^& I paid for....PERIOD!!! end of it."-MiSt3r GRiNch

And here is one of the counter arguments:

"Behemoth responded accordingly and handled the situation and the ball is in Micro Soft's court...as for the game being broken I have friends come over and play and only played online one time to help someone beat the game..The game has a few bugs but what game doesn't...nobody is ever satisfied with the work a lot of these companies (like Behemoth) put into these games...they did everything they were supposed to and now we just got to wait for micro soft...as far as the points I feel it is one of the best way I could have spent ms points this year"-xLIQUID SWORDSx

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The car analogy was an analogy in scenario only, not economics. But I guess some people don't understand that. Not to mention you can't "test drive" a video game unless they put a demo out for it , so your counterpoint (was it a counterpoint? I don't even know) is weak.

But fine, scrap the car analogy. I buy a hammer from the hardware store for $5, and the head falls off. Sure, I still have the hammerhead, and I still have the hammer handle, and I'm sure I could find some use for the 2 of them, but they certainly aren't working like the purchaser intended them to work.

Can I bring it back? In the real world, sure. In Virtual-Videogame Land, Microsoft and Behemoth (thought it's not just them, it's the whole industry) can hide behind the "We don't take refunds no matter what" legalese. Hell, what would happen if my $15 I gave them was defective and actually $5? Oh that's right, I'd be in jail for fraud! I know, I know, different situation, right? ;)

The people defending a broken product where the consumer has no recourse except to take it and like it are absolutely shameful. Oh, and since Castle Crashers didn't "break the bank" to purchase, that seems to imply that if we spent more on this game, the state of the product would THEN be unacceptable?

Regardless, many of us are complaining on principle, not on the "break the bank" theory - which is what many people who are defending this game and company are hiding behind because they can't justify such a shoddy product otherwise (I mean, it's not like we're talking some slightly glitchy graphics or something). Braid didn't have this problem, did it? I don't hear people complaining about Braid saves suddenly disappearing, and Braid's developers aren't exactly a huge shop...

But I digress. I've learned my lesson, and that's that the next time Behemoth comes out with a game, I'll let the morons who rush to pay to beta test it for the first 6 months - at which point hopefully the patch will come out before I forget it's out and move onto some other title. I'm tired of being one of the morons who beta tested Castle Crashers when it was in production.

PS - you wanna talk about breaking the bank? I don't know Behemoth's financial situation, but I can guarantee they're high-fiving microsoft's no refund policy, else they'd be in a financial world of hurt right about now.

Christ almighty, some people will complain about anything :P

Have fun playing your other games [:

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dude, absolutely right.

I mean hell, ill complain about the internet glitches, BUT WHO THE HECK WOULDNT.

Maybe you should give the behemoth community some time before completely dissing them and throwing them behind. Plus, two player with someone on your friendslist with good ping can still play, so the online isnt completely crap. And one reason ppl lose there data is because:

they join someone elses game in the character select screen, wich is the main cause of loss. Another is swapping memory cards.

so dont do that and you wont have to worry as much about data loss. And still CC is probobly the best arcade game out their. And jesus, people say were "defending" behemoth, we are supporting them, so why dont people just shut the hell up and wat for the TU.

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Colino, if you hate the Behemoth so much then why are you here? I play their games cause I'm a fan of the old-school 2d genres. If you don't want to spend another penny on anymore of their products, nobody's not stopping you, but don't try to make us "fanboys" look bad for supporting a rare company that follows specific types of games that are potentially dead. Other companies I could compare to TB are Treasure and Konjak (as well as doujin developers), that's it.

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I don't hate BEHEMOTH, actually quite the contrary. I do NOT however think gamers who purchased a product should be stuck with said BROKEN product. I don't care if the creators are busy, I purchased a product that was supposed to work online and offline, it does not. Simple as that. If I bought a DVD that didn't play (actually I did and Meaning of Life was repressed and a new disc was shipped out immediately) I would return it or AT LEAST expect the product to be fixed in a timely matter. Did I register and log in just to puppy? You betcha, I love this damn game and wish I could play it with friends online which is actually why I bought the game.

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Colino, if you hate the Behemoth so much then why are you here? I play their games cause I'm a fan of the old-school 2d genres. If you don't want to spend another penny on anymore of their products, nobody's not stopping you, but don't try to make us "fanboys" look bad for supporting a rare company that follows specific types of games that are potentially dead. Other companies I could compare to TB are Treasure and Konjak (as well as doujin developers), that's it.

You obviously didn't read a single word I typed, or possibly didn't understand it.

Who says I hate Behemoth? I f***ing LOVE the Behemoth, that's why this situation is even worse!

The fact that I've ALWAYS supported them way back since Alien Hominid for consoles, not only with games but with all kinds of merchandise, even Dan's own individual merchandise like his prints and wall-clocks.

That is exactly why this is even more painful for me, to see this go on and realize, unlike other blind fanboys, that Behemoth isn't acting 100% the right way, that's what makes it dissapointing in the first place!

That's the difference between a supporter and a fanboy, the later is simply blind, and has done probably nothing to actually support whatever he's a fan for.

A supporter, which is what I believe to be, will stick with whatever he's supporting UNTIL whatever it is doesn't act up to their standards.

I've supported Behemoth, I might continue to do so in the future, but until they get their act up, I can't say I'm that much of a fan anymore.

I don't see what's hard to understand about that.

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Colino, if you hate the Behemoth so much then why are you here? I play their games cause I'm a fan of the old-school 2d genres. If you don't want to spend another penny on anymore of their products, nobody's not stopping you, but don't try to make us "fanboys" look bad for supporting a rare company that follows specific types of games that are potentially dead. Other companies I could compare to TB are Treasure and Konjak (as well as doujin developers), that's it.

You obviously didn't read a single word I typed, or possibly didn't understand it.

Who says I hate Behemoth? I f***ing LOVE the Behemoth, that's why this situation is even worse!

The fact that I've ALWAYS supported them way back since Alien Hominid for consoles, not only with games but with all kinds of merchandise, even Dan's own individual merchandise like his prints and wall-clocks.

That is exactly why this is even more painful for me, to see this go on and realize, unlike other blind fanboys, that Behemoth isn't acting 100% the right way, that's what makes it dissapointing in the first place!

That's the difference between a supporter and a fanboy, the later is simply blind, and has done probably nothing to actually support whatever he's a fan for.

A supporter, which is what I believe to be, will stick with whatever he's supporting UNTIL whatever it is doesn't act up to their standards.

I've supported Behemoth, I might continue to do so in the future, but until they get their act up, I can't say I'm that much of a fan anymore.

I don't see what's hard to understand about that.

Spoken like a true fighter. Live on mah brothah, live on. ~snaps instead of claps~

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Guest Apollo
Plus, two player with someone on your friendslist with good ping can still play, so the online isnt completely crap.

Oh really? I love how the "defenders" of Castle Crasher's quality can speak on behalf of all user experiences. For instance, I can't play 2 player online (me and a friend), without a constant "stutter" every 3 seconds. A few levels in, and the game boots us out - every single time.

I didn't purchase the game to play solo. And if I can't play 2 players, you can sure as hell bet I can't play 4. I'm glad I didn't spend enough time in this game after having to deal with the online lag to find out that my save game could just get wiped out. That woulduv been a real hoot...

Defective. Product. Period.

Christ, I wish I could return my Gears of War 2 as well, since the multiplayer matchmaking system is basically broken. But sadly, the "No Returns" policy the industry hides behind strikes again. At least with Epic, they provide an FAQ of their known issues and a tentative patch release schedule...

Que sera sera.

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